


Flowey and PTSD

by ArgentDandelion



Category: Undertale (Video Game)
Genre: Character Analysis, Emotional Hurt, Gen, Heavy Angst, Medication, Mental Anguish, Mental Health Issues, Nonfiction, Photoshop Flowey (Undertale), Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder - PTSD, Recovery, Therapy, Time Travel, Trauma, Undertale Saves and Resets, Violence
Language: English
Status: Completed
Published: 2019-08-08
Updated: 2019-08-08
Packaged: 2020-08-13 01:17:30
Rating: Teen And Up Audiences
Warnings: Major Character Death
Chapters: 2
Words: 2,109
Publisher: archiveofourown.org
Story URL: https://archiveofourown.org/works/20165746
Author URL: https://archiveofourown.org/users/ArgentDandelion/pseuds/ArgentDandelion
Summary: An article series arguing Flowey has PTSD, starting with the symptoms and then going on to possible treatment options.





	1. Chapter 1

**Introduction and Thesis**

_Above: Something not necessary._

_ **Warning: This post necessarily covers Flowey’s dark, traumatic, and sad backstory.** For simplicity’s sake, this article will refer to the first fallen human as “Chara”. _

In many works, Flowey receives a SOUL or SOULs or regains his original SOUL, gets an Asriel-like body, and acts largely as Asriel. The implicit understanding of these works is that gaining a SOUL and become Asriel-like/Asriel again is the only way Flowey can be happy.

But what if gaining a SOUL wasn’t actually necessary?

As [Devichonee](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fweb.archive.org%2Fweb%2F20170707143733%2Fhttp%3A%2F%2Fdevichonee.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F161248986695&t=OTU3NDA2ZDdjMzc2YjMzMGE2NzlhMjhkNjM0OTk2OTY0ZDZlZWYyMyxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) pointed out in a tragically missing post, some of Flowey’s symptoms, such as unhappiness, disassociation from reality (i.e. “This is all just a GAME.”), and inability to connect with others parallel symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), especially child cases.[1](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182408400143/flowey-and-ptsd-part-1#fn:1) His backstory, after all, is traumatic enough to cause PTSD. By _Undertale_ logic, humans would still have SOULs even after developing PTSD, so Flowey’s soullessness isn’t necessarily the cause of his symptoms.[2](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182408400143/flowey-and-ptsd-part-1#fn:2) If he does indeed have PTSD, treating it would help him get a happy ending too.

* * *

##  **Strong/Best-Supported Symptoms**

While Flowey has several symptoms which seem to match a PTSD diagnosis, some symptoms are more consistent or intense than others.

[The](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chop.edu%2Fconditions-diseases%2Fpost-traumatic-stress-disorder-children&t=MzY1ZTZmMjRjMzQ3NGU5YTFmZjI4ODAyY2JmM2JlNzczNTZkMjg4YixYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) [symptoms](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fchildrensmentalhealth%2Fptsd.html&t=MDBjYWVhMGU3ODlhMzA1OTgyNDFlYTJiZWFkZThiMjg2ZjYyYjRmMSxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) which match best are:

**“Loss of interest in things they used to enjoy: detachment; general lack of responsiveness; feeling numb”/“Lack of Positive Emotions”**

Kind, compassionate Asriel likely enjoyed helping others. He and Chara baked a pie for Asgore, and he initially helped Chara with the buttercup plan with only a little coaxing/manipulation. Note that Flowey first used his power for good: he became “friends” with everyone and “solved all their problems flawlessly”. However, helping others did not make him happy, and he eventually grew bored.

Flowey characterizes himself as “empty inside”, and is disconnected (or detached) from others. His soullessness means he cannot feel or understand love and compassion. However, he is [not actually emotionless](http://nochocolate.tumblr.com/post/160524265177/floweys-ability-to-feel): he can feel a wide variety of emotions. He’s even capable of positive ones: he’s amused or delighted at the prospect of killing Frisk over and over. Thus, his numbness and “lack of positive emotions” is relative.

* * *

**“Trouble feeling affectionate”**  


As a flower, Flowey couldn’t feel love for his parents, no matter how much he tried or how much time he spent with them.  
While he cannot feel love nor compassion, he nonetheless seems fond of who he thinks is Chara, and arguably even acts affectionate. (“Chara…I think if you’re around…just living in the surface world doesn’t seem so bad.”) Yet, he probably doesn’t _feel_ affectionate:

> “There’s only one person [Chara] I could care about anymore.  
And even then, I couldn’t TRULY care about them.  
I just like to think there’s someone out there…  
Someone that I won’t get tired of.”

**“Irritability, more aggressive than before, or even violent”**  
While Flowey is certainly more aggressive and violent than Asriel, it’s unclear whether his irritability is reasonable under the circumstances or related to his PTSD.

**“Reenactment of an event for a period of seconds or hours or, very rarely, days/Relieving [sic] the event over and over in thought or in play”**

As [Devichonee](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fweb.archive.org%2Fweb%2F20170617092635%2Fhttp%3A%2F%2Fdevichonee.tumblr.com%2F&t=MGU3MGU4NTcyZDY2MjQzZmVhNzY2ZGQ5YWE1N2JiNDVmODRiYTliZSxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) pointed out, when Flowey woke up as a flower he called out for help: his mom, his dad, or anybody. But nobody came. Similarly, when Frisk is trapped in an inescapable ring of bullets in the Omega Flowey fight, he dares them to call for help. When they do, he changes his face to an Asriel/Toriel-like one and says: “Mommy! Daddy! Somebody help!”

[The lines](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2Fa%2F7edTU&t=NDRkYWEyOTNhODI0Mjg5ZmRiMjI2YmUxN2JmODYwZWY3MTU2Y2IyMCxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) “Don’t you get it? This is all just a GAME.” suggests Flowey thinks his life is just a game. (He’s only coincidentally right.) This idea might be a coping mechanism helping him feel better, something that excuses his depravity, or both: coping mechanisms can hurt others.

##  **Weaker/Less-Supported Symptoms**

These are less consistent and intense symptoms. Some, arguably, are not PTSD symptoms at all, but are better explained by other factors.

**“Becoming very upset when something causes memories of the event”**

Flowey may have been so distressed at Frisk repeatedly sparing him at the end of the Omega Flowey fight because it paralleled Asriel’s own behavior: kind, compassionate Asriel refused to fight the humans attacking him.

**“Intense ongoing fear or sadness”**  
Flowey was sad at Chara’s death, but since the time span of events in the Flowey Runs is unclear, it’s not clear whether his sadness or fear is “intense” or “ongoing”.

**“Acting helpless, hopeless or withdrawn”.**  


Flowey is certainly not helpless; he has powers over time. Yet, his Flowey Runs may suggest feeling hopeless and withdrawn. Before he discovered his power of SAVE, he was despondent. He spent weeks trying to feel some love for his father, but eventually concluded he couldn’t love others. He explains that even killing people has grown tiring, and says: “I’ve done everything this world has to offer” with a somewhat dejected expression.

**“Lasting worries and beliefs and people and the world being unsafe”**  
Having absorbed Chara’s SOUL, Asriel brought Chara’s lifeless body to a flower patch in the nearby human village. The humans then attacked him, but he did not fight back. He picked up Chara’s body, went back to the Underground, and died shortly after from his injuries.

> **[Asriel](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2Fa%2FThTk8&t=OWQ2MTJmNzBlMWM1OWVjNjA2NzFlMzY1ZGQ1NTYzOTdmODc5YjAwOSxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1):** “This whole time, I’ve blamed myself for that decision. [to not kill the humans attacking him]  
"That’s why I adopted that horrible view of the world.  
"Kill or be killed.”

Flowey believed being kind and compassionate as Asriel only got him killed, and that if had killed the humans then, he wouldn’t be stuck as a flower and things would be better. Only by the flowerbed speech (see link above) does he stop regretting that decision.

* * *

  1. Child PTSD is diagnosed only if “symptoms persist for more than 1 month and are adversely affecting the child’s life and level of functioning”. Flowey surely spent more than a month in countless Flowey Runs: if the [9999:99 play time](http://nochocolate.tumblr.com/post/164983130095/i-have-another-question-to-ask-again-i-am-not) recorded before the Omega Flowey fight is true and not a sign of tampering, Flowey has lived through time loops for at least ~416.69 days (or 13.699 months). [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182408400143/flowey-and-ptsd-part-1#fnref:1)

  2. Does the Snowman, which doesn’t turn to dust when “killed”, have a SOUL? [(Who knows?)](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DAhUnvgMaHjE&t=ZDg2Y2U5MGMzYTJlM2ZjNzMwZDU5YmQ2YTY0MjQ3MzVlZGMxZjYwZCxYbVllMEcwYw%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182408400143%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-1&m=1) While the character Jerry is a jerk, he surely has a SOUL. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182408400143/flowey-and-ptsd-part-1#fnref:2)


	2. Treatment and Conclusion

**Getting Treatment**

**Source: Potoobrigham’s [Growth Spurt](http://potoobrigham.tumblr.com/post/165300296896/hell-need-a-few-more-appointments-but-i-think) comics**

Warning: This post necessarily covers Flowey’s dark, traumatic, and sad backstory. For simplicity’s sake, this article will refer to the first fallen human as “Chara”.

* * *

If Flowey didn’t have PTSD/PTSD-like symptoms (or simply “PTSD”) he would be happier and stabler, so getting PTSD treatment could help.[1](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fn:1) But for Flowey to get treatment for his PTSD, he would first need a diagnosis.

In child cases of PTSD, children may [not want to](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fchildrensmentalhealth%2Fptsd.html&t=YTVmMTM1MTk2YzZhMzc3M2IwYmI3NjExZWI0MmI5NjI0ZmU4YjBkMSxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1) talk about their trauma. Outside the Genocide Route, where he believes he’s talking to Chara, Flowey doesn’t talk much about his trauma. So unless Frisk had heard Flowey’s story in that route, by default Frisk would not have enough information to help Flowey with his trauma. Therefore, they’d have to learn Flowey’s story later in the narrative, or Flowey’s therapist would have to learn about it.

Alternately, someone else could learn about Flowey’s trauma and symptoms. It could be Papyrus, who considers Flowey a friend, or even Flowey himself while reading about PTSD. However, if Flowey did read about PTSD, he might not connect his behaviors and attitudes to it, or have insufficient knowledge of mental illnesses and their causes and might want to avoid the stigma of needing a “shrink”.

* * *

##  **Treatment Plan**

**Talk Therapy**

Flowey would likely divulge aspects of his trauma without much urging. He’s probably already told people his story in countless Flowey Runs, who may or may not have believed him. Frisk could get Flowey to gradually reveal his story by asking him which people he killed, and why. Flowey might be baffled, but he would surely volunteer the information and enjoy doing so.

However, the talk therapy approach has two problems.  
Firstly, Frisk or someone else close to Flowey might not know enough to eventually get to buttercup plan details.   
Secondly, his lack of love and compassion and his perception that the people of the Underground are predictable playthings could negate any benefits from talk therapy, and discourage further disclosure.

**Social Support**

Social support[2](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fn:2) and support groups are an option: some kids and teens with PTSD find [support groups helpful](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fkidshealth.org%2Fen%2Fparents%2Fptsd.html&t=ZTkwMTA2Mzg0YzE2MWY4MWM0ZjMwNmQ3MDYyZmZmMGNkYTUxNDI4ZSxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1).   
However, Flowey might not benefit. His trauma is severe and complex, and some parts (Flowey Runs) are incomparable to any likely experience. Flowey’s trauma, too, may be so much worse than the others that their problems seem minor and inconsequential to him.

**Cognitive Behavioral Therapy/Reappraisal**

In [cognitive-behavioral therapy](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FCognitive_behavioral_therapy&t=ZmE4NWIxMTAyZDA2YWJkYjgwZjU1ZTc0OTk1YjU0ZGYxMDdlMzAyMyxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1), unhelpful cognitive distortions (e.g., beliefs, thoughts, and attitudes), feelings, and behaviors are replaced with positive ones. Therapists and caretakers could tell Flowey that the traumatic event (Chara’s death) is not his fault[^3: they could say Chara might have executed the buttercup plan or found some other way to die regardless of whether Asriel helped. (This could help in his regrets regardless of whether it’s actually true.)

Another way is reappraising his thought patterns: he could change “I failed Chara” to “I didn’t fail Chara. Chara helped me save monsterkind, because now I can absorb human SOULs and monster SOULs.”[3](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fn:5)

Or, perhaps: “Since I’ve memorized monsters’ psychological reactions, I have extensive, incomparable life experience, and therefore the wisdom to ensure monsters have the happiest future.”

Or even: “If something really bad happens [e.g., nuclear war][4](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fn:6)]I know I can absorb human SOULs to gain godlike power and stop it. I’m the only one with any experience with this power. Also, I can release SOULs; other monsters can’t/might not be able to, so if I do try to abuse the power of a god, the SOULs might stop me.”

**Problems with Therapy**

These treatments have some problems. It’s unlikely Flowey would want to disclose important SAVE-related details to therapists or support groups, especially humans who might be alarmed at the potential of a “monster” (he’d probably be mistaken for one) with power over time itself.

**Medication & Other**

Medication might help decrease Flowey’s PTSD symptoms, but this would be tricky. Though plants can respond in a sophisticated way to their environments, communicate, and even make decisions, they aren’t considered sentient or intelligent, like Flowey. Therefore, there’s just no research that would even suggest a treatment.

Fertile soil, sunlight, and plenty of water makes most plants prosper, and a nutritious diet and getting enough water alleviates depression. Plant-style accommodations might help Flowey, but if so, not by much: dirt and water can’t solve trauma.

* * *

## Conclusion & Caveats

While this is actually the opposite of its original context, it’s still appropriate.

In conclusion, giving Flowey a soul is not necessary to make him fairly happy. Though his soullessness might have caused his inability to feel love and compassion, his inability could also have been caused by PTSD[5](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fn:7), countless Flowey Runs, and perhaps the belief a soulless ex-monster couldn’t feel love or compassion.

In any case, his PTSD symptoms aren’t his only problem. While addressing his PTSD symptoms would improve his life, addressing it with other possible factors (the topic of a future post) would help even more.

There’s one caveat: what if monster/soulless flower psychology is different from human psychology? What if human mental illnesses don’t apply to monsters? Still, this caveat is probably no problem: fans commonly diagnose Sans with depression/anhedonia, without considering how mental illnesses might be different among monsters.

* * *

  1. Indeed, Flowey takes therapy in some fan works. Potoobrigham’s Growth Spurt is a borderline example, for Flowey apparently got an Asriel body through as-yet unspecified means before taking therapy. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fnref:1)

  2. _[A Dogs of Future Past](http://lynxgriffin.tumblr.com/post/145243002663/dogs-of-future-past-masterpost)_ story does this, sort of: Frisk checks back with Flowey and brings him up to the Surface because he’s the only one who knows what it’s like to have the power of SAVE, with all the frightening and painful consequences of that. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fnref:2)

  3. In fact, this line of thinking is part of his [flower bed speech](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2Fa%2FThTk8&t=ZTEzMWE5MzU3MmQ5YzdkNWQxYTI3ZmIwMjdlNDVkNmYwN2I4NGFiNSxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1), but since the playable epilogue is optional, it might not have happened in fan works. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fnref:5)

  4. In _[Soul Dichromatism](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Farchiveofourown.org%2Fworks%2F6883084%2Fchapters%2F16499722%23workskin&t=ZjAyZDA4MmJmYjRiNGEyZmYzZTA2NTdiYjcwMDUwNjdiZWQ3MWY4ZSxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1)_, something like this actually happens, though with Asgore. On a related note, a bonus story from _Dogs of Future Past_ where Flowey absorbs donated human SOULs mentions that if he goes bad, the SOULS will surely rebel against him, and he’ll be a flower again. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fnref:6)

  5. People with PTSD [apparently](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sciencedaily.com%2Freleases%2F2016%2F03%2F160310112400.htm&t=Nzg0NzkyYzBkN2VhYWU1YmYxNTk5ZDIxZmE3YjgyOTkyNTY2MTM4YyxyWGpGUnZHWg%3D%3D&b=t%3AHZZTbr56CX-Pu8cYzedJTw&p=https%3A%2F%2Fargentdandelion.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F182590189723%2Fflowey-and-ptsd-part-2&m=1) can have less compassion than those with no psychiatric problems. [↩︎](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/post/182590189723/flowey-and-ptsd-part-2#fnref:7)

**Author's Note:**

> Originally posted on my [Tumblr](https://argentdandelion.tumblr.com/). Feel free to comment on this article there or here.


End file.
